This topic contains 10 replies, has 6 voices, and was last updated by jackie 6 years, 2 months ago.
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Hi Ray,
I have been mulching with black plastic for a few months now to weaken rampant horsetail and bindweed on my plot. These particular weeds are so strong and persistent (particularly horsetail) that they will make a bee line for any daylight at all. So, if you are mulching to knock back weeds, depending on which ones you are dealing with, punching holes in your mulch sheeting may counteract the very thing that you are trying to do.
If your motivations are otherwise, ignore what I have said! Good luck!
Hello again Ray
Perhaps you could describe the soil you are planning to cover with compost and black plastic?
Is it covered with weeds? What type? Is it very dry at the moment or wet?
What vegetables are you planning to plant and when will you plant them?Compostpope
So lucky I am yes, 3 acres.
My soil is so dry now that I cannot even test the drainage.
My spade broke when I tried to make a hole. But people say it is normal
because no rain at all for almost two months.I did some testing of the soil last spring and it seems to me that it is
between clay and sand because I can make sausages that hold together almost.
They somehow fall apart but not totally.I tested the ph to be about 6.5 which should be fine for all the berries I want to plant this fall.
Yes I did put all this plastic one week ago to avoid any week this spring but it is not clear to me whether Charles recommends plastic with holes or not. I will put green compost under the plastic in about two or three weeks.
I do not know yet what kind of weeds I have because not much growing now without the rain.
I also want to set aside about one acre where I will grow according the permaculture traditions of Fukuoka. No compost, only sowing white clover and planting by throwing seeds from vegetables and fruit trees all over the area.
But for the rest of the land, yes, I thought that I should test the soil for deficiencies, don’t you do this ? Or is this just another business strategy from labs offering such things
What do I want to grow ? First of all everything that is expensive ! Artichokes, Asparagus, Pumkins, Salads (the previous owner gave me an old variety that has an awesome taste, I will send you some when I get the grains) and then all kinds of vegetables I fancy to eat, which is everything according to seasons. Are there in season vegetables that are no good to eat ? And lots and lots of berries that I will plant this fall. 30 plants of blueberries, 50 plants of strawberries, and so on…
I also want to try Pistachios and Pomegranates. It is more of Mediterrean fruits but I am somewhat in between the Atlantic and the Mediterrean, closer to th eMediterrean actually, close to the city of Albi, northest of Toulouse.
Fresh Pistachios are so good ! and fresh Pomegranates are awesome !
Okey, I will try not to get carries away now.Charles said that soon we will be able to post photos on this forum. That will be great, then we can share, not tastes but at least the beauties of it all.
Thanks to both of you for your input.
Raymond
Hi Ray
Charles always uses plastic with no holes in, as a previous poster has said the holes would provide a means for the weeds one is trying to suppress to reach daylight and grow, which defeats the object.
This is the same for cardboard, where we try to ensure that there are no holes or gaps for weeds to grow through.
Steph
Hello Ray
If your ground is as dry as you say I think you should wait until it rains a lot and your soil is nice and moist before you put on any compost on top of it. I plan to put mine on in November. I have found that a big advantage of the no-dig method is that even in hot weather I don’t have to water much because the compost layer keeps the soil underneath nice and moist – but I suspect that the soil has to be moist to begin with!
You could use black plastic (without lots of little holes!) before you put on the compost if you want to prepare the beds by killing off some of the weeds – pulling it back when rain is expected. After you have put on your compost in late autumn you could put the plastic on top of it and cut holes where you want to plant your fruit bushes. If you don’t have any tough weeds though you may not have to use the plastic at all as most ordinary weeds will not survive being buried by 7–15 cm of compost. Many people in England have to use black plastic when they take over an allotment that is full of weeds such as marestail, couch grass, blackberries or bindweed which are all very tough weeds.
Most vegetables and fruit grow well in most soils and plenty of compost makes soil even better for growing plants so I would only use a soil test if I found my plants were not growing well.
I am fairly new to this no-digging method, so I am interested to hear if what I have said is complete rubbish!
3 acres is a lot of garden – it would be too much for me! What are you going to do with all that fruit and veg?
I have not heard of the Fukuoka method, from the way you describe it, it sounds like complete nonsense but I am sure there must be more to it than what you write…
Compostpope
Yes it is worth waiting for it to rain before mulching with plastic, when as dry as chez Raymond. You can spread compost now though.
Every situation, planting and weather past and to come, means slight variations in the approach needed. Then one’s initial plan may need to change as unexpected weather and weeds appear, so I can’t give a precise formula here, just the principles. I hope you have some rain soon Ray, the plantings sound exciting, I would maybe do a little less than you suggest, start small and build up once you see what works.
Also the Fukuoka method is incredibly skilled with precise timings and is suitable to his particular climate (warm and damp), so I would try that on a small area first.
Thank you for your input. It all makes sense. Fukuoka also says that if you sow white clover and let it grow as a permanent sort of grass to keep weeds low, then create clay pellets to sow a mixture of veggies, berries and trees, and let nature have its way, surprising things happens. Certainly worth trying on a small area of my 3 acres, just for the fun of it, to see what happens during five years. For the rest of my land, I will plant lots of artichokes and asparagus and lots of berries and BIG trees, not the minature ones but the big big trees simply because they are so beautiful. I know, takes a long time to get the fruits going, but I love beautiful big trees and will eat berries until I get fruits
Hi Ray
I’ve looked this up on youtube and I’m pleased to say I was right – there certainly is a lot more to it than I first thought! I can see how it would be a very useful method for farmers in the oppressed world trying to free themselves from inappropriate high-input western agricultural practices….
I’m not sure how it would work on a small plot like mine (I’ll need to do some more research on the internet) but it will interesting to hear how it works on your 3 acres.
Incidently, I like SMALL trees because I like to have lots of different types of fruit and also I don’t like climbing ladders!!
Good luck with your garden!
Compostpope
And what you say about small trees and more variety, THANKS ! I never thought about that and although 3 acres is a lot more than most people have, were I to plant only big trees grown from seeds, there won’t be many trees growing
so perhaps a few big ones from seeds and lots of small grafted ones is a good way to go. I am now reading about forest gardens and that is real inspiring. But I also see that most people that get into these permacultures and who ALSO want to have plenty to eat, also grow a more classic garden for annual veggies since a forest garden takes many years to get going and never will give as many asparagus and artichokes that I like to eat. What is your garden like ?Hello!
When Charles plants squash through a plastic mulch over a weedy area does he try to water the plants through the planting hole during the growing season?
Jackie
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