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But I’m not saying no dig is more work! I’m talking in general terms about the demands of a plot – and people often believe a new approach will take more of their time. Please read what I posted.
Hi Steph – I think you may have misunderstood what I was getting at. The point I was making is allotments in general can be difficult for people to commit the time they would like to. Whether it’s no dig or traditional methods. I have seen this first hand working with the local council to encourage and help plot holders to manage their plots more effectively.
Indeed I would argue that the results you and Charles achieve are in part because you do it every day – whether it’s your own plot or an employers garden. You are, if you like, zeroed into the mindset of growing produce and managing the land full time. However most people do it in addition to a seperate full time job, bringing up children, etc.
Yes, no dig is a much more sympathetic and easier method of growing produce. It is less intensive and in the long run requires less input of time and money, and the results are fantastic. But the reality is – as I witness on our local allotments every season – not everyone has the time and resources to even contemplate switching. Which is a sad indictment of our modern busy lives, not a criticism of no dig.
John – the irony now is that St Georges Hill is an ultra-exclusive gated community where footballers, golfers, and hedgefund managers live. A cosmic slap in the face for it’s revolutionary heritage.
Steph – not quite sure why that comment was directed at me.
As a newbie on the forum (although a long time fan of Charles’ pioneering work) just thought I should clear up my choice of username. For the record it doesn’t refer to a pro-dig agenda. Far from it.
It refers to the undoubted great, great grandfather of allotments Gerrard Winstanley – in 1649 he led a group of rebellious comrades to take over some land in Surrey (St George’s Hill) in protest at the Inclosure of common land. They became known as Diggers because they sought to cultivate land and encourage anyone to join them – all you had to do was offer your labour and you’d be rewarded with a share in the produce. The landowner had different ideas (the local vicar, how charitable!), and a gang of local thugs were sent to drive them off. Winstanley produced a prolific amount of literature at the time setting out his views. One particular line has always resonated:
Was the earth made to preserve a few covetous, proud men to live at ease, and for them to bag and barn up the treasures of the Earth from others, that these may beg or starve in a fruitful land; or was it made to preserve all her children?
So my choice of moniker is in recognition of Gerrard Winstanley, and the stand he tried to take against vested interests who were pilfering the common law inheritance of the ordinary man and woman.
Thanks peat for the heads up on Fortier – right up my street!
As a caveat I have worked out that I could buy the 4x80ltr bags to cover the full plot for £175, or £200 for 3 cubic metres delivered bulk. I’d need 70 x 80ltr bags! That’s a lot of bags of muck.
Also, the lady asking the question states Liverpool soil is sandy (I’m sure it’s as varied across the city as anywhere else!) But if we take that at face value then a decent layer would surely be recommended if starting out? Charles himself in his first book advocates (pp21-22) a total of 6 inches if preparing a virgin bed, with annual dressings of 2 inches. The article linked to reinforces this.
The paradox is that No Dig is ultimately an easier and less physically intensive system. But it requires the commitment, and time to achieve the results Charles has. Most don’t have that when they’re tending a plot in between family and work.
Hi John
Listen I have a lot of time for No Dig, and Charles won me over several years ago. I just think what Christine said needs treating with a bit of objectivity – and there is plenty of evidence that GQT (and Ms. Walkden) are broadly supportive of the thinking behind No Dig.
I live in a busy town in Berkshire. I have a 112sqm plot on Bagshot sand. On the basis of a 5cm depth I have concluded – very, very roughly – that I would need 5.6 cubic metres of compost or organic matter to cover it for No Dig. Obviously I wouldn’t cover the whole plot. Even if I went with 3 cubic metres the best price I can get it locally (from a firm who knocks out very good composted stable manure in bulk and supplies all the local garden centres with 4×80 litre bags for a £10) – I’m looking at £200.
As for alternatives – my bins hold one cubic metre each. I crammed two with leaves last year and now have a rough leafmold that has reduced to a quarter of one bin. I reckon I could get a very thin layer on a fifth of the plot. But I only have that much because I have a van and over the course of a week went out with a leaf blower and collected as many leaves locally as I could. I can source stable manure myself – to collect in the van. I’m fairly confident it doesn’t contain traces of Aminopyralid (a major problem for gardeners using manure). Even so I have to put aside a day or so to shovel and transport the manure from the stables then have the space and time for it rot before I can mulch with it. Last year one bin ended up producing a sixth of what went in raw.
Unfortunately these are all considerations that have to be openly acknowledged and there are many gardeners who I’m sure would love to go No Dig but the relative costs, resources, and time can put them off. As it is many people struggle with an allotment as they underestimate the work required. Fortunately I do have the time, resources, and inclination to commit to No Dig.
But out of a mixed site of 70 plots with young mums, retirees, disabled, and relatively fit gardeners only 3 of us do it.
Thanks for the reply and advice Dan – greatly appreciated.
Can anybody guide me on how to approach landowners with a view to renting a plot of land? I’m conscious of pitching it just right and in order to allay any fears that my approach may trigger.
Cheers, Andy
Thank you for your replies Charles and Frances
I guess I’m fortunate in that my wife works full time and has been the breadwinner for eight years while I’ve stayed at home with the children. Now that the youngest is at school f/t I’m ready to carve out a new path for myself.
I’ve never been afraid of hard work – at least where growing’s concerned – and I’m lucky that I come from a family with a strong horticulture background.
I also know it won’t be something that is an overnight success straight away – but with the family income fairly secure I feel I can dedicate passion and drive to move on from it being a hobby on an allotment to a potential enterprise.
Many thanks
Could be verticillium wilt – a soil borne fungal disease. My first earlies have it unfortunately. It’s tempting to say it’s a bit early but I know Blight Alert have logged outbreaks already.
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