[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello fellas…

We seem to be experiencing the same problem, and were wondering exactly what you might mean by ‘chopping back’? Do you mean trimming off any effected leaves, or thinning effected plants?
Thanks,

JP.

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

Thanks for the reply.
As you know, we were trying the Fertile Fibre stuff, but we’ve subsequently switched over to West Riding, and have tried their Moorland Gold, seedling and their potting compost… with the same results. The tomato plants germinate beautifully, in any of the mediums. They last about a month, and then all go the same way – the seed leaves, wither and fall off, and then the true leaves (and any other leaves) all gradually turn pale and wither.
The first plants we grew (mid-Feb), in the Fertile Fibre, have actually been left in the modules outside since mid-March, and interestingly, they don’t seem to have died. If anything, the leaves that have survived (in a loose sense of the word) actually look quite nicely dark green!
The second plants we grew (mid-March) were started in WR sowing compost and moved into WR potting compost at the beginning of April. We moved them when the seed leaves started looking a bit pale, thinking that was a sign to get them into bigger pots. They lasted until the second week of April before the same symptoms started.
The third lot (end of March) were sown into WR sowing compost, and they’re still with us at the moment. We’ve moved some into WR potting compost (as we’ve been led to believe that it would be better to get them out of the sowing compost when the first true leaves appear), and into two different size modules (to see if that makes a difference). Some of the original plants have been left in the sowing compost, at the moment. So, we currently have three different trials.
One thought occurs to us – is it simply better to start tomatoes with the potting compost rather than worrying about starting with the sowing compost?
I do have some pictures, but I can’t work out how to get them on here. I can email them to you, if that’s ok?
I think the conservatory has a tendency to get overly hot, and so we’re also wondering whether it might have something to do with airflow – lack of, or insufficient air movement – in the conservatory.
To tie this in with the other thread, we’re havng almost exactly the same problems with our brassicas!
Your brassicas have been in full sun on the bench for three or four weeks – we’ve tried putting ours outside, as leaving them on the bench was resulting in them all dying off.

Thanks again for all your help,

JP

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

Thanks for the reply.
I also noticed your brassicas in your April diary… they all look great! Do you keep them on a heated bench from germination (as well as under full sun) until they’re ready to go outside?

Thanks again…

JP

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

Thanks for all the advice – including the details on the other threads, including ‘Steps to victory’!
Our problem with the brassicas is apparently ongoing. We’re on our second sowing of cabbages and cauliflower, and the first sowing of brussels sprouts. As you know, we were trying the fibre compost, and we swtiched over to West Riding seed compost.
After the description of our last efforts, we followed your tips and advice, but we’ve run into the same problem – the brassica seedlings start off looking really good, and we pricked them out and moved them into individual modules just before the first true leaves start appearing. But then, after perhaps a week or so, the seed leaves start turning pale, then start drooping, and then the whole seedling collapses.
We’ve wondered whether it’s the compost (then we changed from fibre to the WR seed compost); we’ve wondered whether it’s tap water (which we then switched to rain water collected in a water butt); we’ve wondered whether it’s the seed (we’ve used Tamar Organics and Chase Garden organics – the Tamar all come up well, but all die off; the Chase Garden are still with us… just); we’ve wondered whether it’s air circulation or ventilation in the conservatory; we’ve wondered whether it’s temperature or sunlight (we moved them outside into a small covered cold frame a couple of days after pricking them out, on sunny days – we discovered today how hot the cold frame was getting inside); we’ve run out of ideas!
The seedlings all seem fine, and a nice healthy, dark green, with firm seed leaves. Then we pricked them out, a few days passed, and then they began looking pale again, and began drooping and dying off – as they did the first time.
Any ideas? We don’t seem to be able to get these right!

Thanks in advance…

JP and JP’s wife

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

I was wondering if it’s possible to rotate simply between a plant type and salad leaves? The example I’m thinking of is rotating between brassicas, then salad leaves (the appropriate varieties – not kale, for example), then brassicas again, then salad leaves, and so on…
Is this something you’ve tried?

Thanks in advance,

JP

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

We’ve set our variable thermostat at about 22 degrees, and we’re using an old fashioned ‘tear drop’ thermometer to measure the temperature of the sand.
During the day, with the room temperature rising, the thermometer (poked into the sand) has registered a maximum of about 24 degrees, on a sunny day. Obviously, during the night, the temperature drops, and I’ve noticed it drop down to about 17 degrees (the lowest I’ve seen so far). At the moment, we’re not monitoring room temperature – how important have you found the ambient temperature to be, for seedlings?
Also, at the moment, we tend to leave the thermostat set at about 22. We were wondering if you adjust the temperture for the evening and during the night?
Thanks in advance,

JP

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

Thanks for the reply – that’s interesting about the Fertile Fibre compost. The lady mentions having problems germinating, which we didn’t have – everything, almost, germinated – and pre-germinated transplants did grow, which we found were a problem (if you consider our seedling transplants as pre-germinated, even though they were germinated in FF and then transplanted into new FF modules).
Also, our FF compost included some leftovers – which, now I think about it, may even have been about 18 months old! Oo-er…
We’ve recently bought a bag of the WRMG seedling compost, so we’ll give that a try and see how things go… We’re trying to stick to a biodynamic plan – have you tried this method, and if so, do you have any tips to follow or advice on pitfalls to avoid? Or any of the other Moon-based growing methods? Have you experienced any effects of growing by the Moon?

On another tack… what are your experiences with horse manure? We’re thinking of trying to use horse manure, and were wondering what differences there may be between cow manure and horse manure – apart from the smell! I think we can only, easily, get horse manure where we are.

Thanks, as always…

JP

[Johnny PhantomMember]

…in addition to my last comment, I forgot to mention that we pulled a few of the cabbages and cauliflowers up, and found that the roots had not grown beyond what they were when we transplanted the seedlings to avoid the legginess. So, we’re wondering if we might have damaged the roots when we transplanted them?

Thanks in advance.

JP

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

Thanks for the reply.
I don’t think we were overdoing the watering – I could be wrong, of course. We were misting the seedlings every two or three days, when the surface of the modules started looking drier. As I mentioned, we were using the fibre compost, which seems to be a little misleading when it comes to gauging dampness – as you’ve mentioned in one of your books. After reading your ‘Organic Gardening’ book, we had over-watering in mind, so were trying not to get too carried away.
The first batch of cabbages and cauliflowers were sown on February 8th – by yesterday, the first seed leaves on all of them had withered completely. The last time the seedlings were misted (which was before the first post in this thread), it was a cloudy day and obviously some water remained on the leaves – that, to me, sounds far too simple an explanation, but we’re having problems working out what went wrong! I have a photograph which I could email you, if necessary.
Apart from that, everything else seems to be proceeding slowly, even though they’re all sitting on the heated bench… we think this might just be due to the colder weather… the lettuces, for example, don’t seem to have done much in a month! Ours seem stuck at the first seed leaves, with one small first true leaf each…
Thanks in advance…

JP

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

Thanks very much… We’ve moved the strongest looking ones, and added some more compost, so, we’ll see… your ‘diary’ entries are always useful, and we found another with some comments on ‘legginess’ from February, 2010.
I think you’re right about the amount of light. Unfortunately, our situation seems to require that we use artificial lights, at the moment. It’s not something I’m that keen on, due to it being just that – artificial.
Thanks again… back soon!

JP

[Johnny PhantomMember]

Hello Charles,

Thanks for the tips. Interestingly, Parasene themselves recommended ‘a light misting’, which didn’t sound quite right…
I’ve had it going for a few days now, and it’s already carrying cabbage, cauliflower, radish and lettuce seedlings… and waiting for some onion varieties to appear… so, fingers crossed!
On a slightly different tack then, with our radishes, we’re trying several to a module – about three or four, roughly – and we’re planning on transplanting them without thinning them out, and harvesting them one at a time, starting with the largest. You’ve mentioned previously about trying this kind of thing with beetroot, I think, and that sounded like a great idea! Have you ever tried this kind of plan with any other vegetables (any less obvious varieties)?
Cheers!

JP

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